New Mandala

12 responses so far ↓

• 1 John Francis Lee // Apr 12, 2007 at 11:35 pm

  I assume that Switzerland’s measured response at the time was because it knew how this was going to go down in the end. I think that the Junta and HM the King were not damaged though. The Junta looks tough and HM looks generous. Jufer looks like a jerk.

• 2 anon // Apr 13, 2007 at 4:33 am

  WTF? He didn’t even go through the appeals process!

• 3 Jon Fernquest // Apr 13, 2007 at 6:35 am

  > Jufer looks like a jerk.

  Jufer was probably one of the many maladjusted chronic alcoholics that come to Thailand to die. Calling him a jerk actually implies that he had control over what he did.

  >It was an unnecessary charge, an outrageous sentence and the >fallout has been damaging for all concerned.

  The Thais got to defend HMK and then feel good when HMK showed mercy, but everyone knew that Jufer was going to be pardoned, given what HMK had said before, making the whole affair kind of meaningless, except it provoked some westerners to make those hateful You Tube postings and then the Thais got angry and blocked You Tube, all based on abstract principles like lese majeste and protecting even hateful free speech. Both sides shoul have backed down.

• 4 Sawarin // Apr 13, 2007 at 7:54 am

  anon: spot on. oh well, I always said Thailand is a kingdom, time for legal academics/ professionals to agree.

• 5 John Francis Lee // Apr 13, 2007 at 1:36 pm

  Calling him a jerk actually implies that he had control over what he did.

  Well… I guess some people still fall for “the devil made me do it” as a defense. As a drunk who no longer drinks himself I do count myself lucky for having been able to quit. Lot’s of others die drunk, as perhaps Lufer will. But I cannot buy “my life is beyond my control” as sufficient to escape the consequences of one’s acts. To explain them, ok. I’m sure that Jufer is not a jerk at all… when he’s not drinking.

  All three sides should have backed down.

• 6 Thai Radio // Apr 13, 2007 at 6:58 pm

  If Juffer had been a Thai nobody would have cared of that story…
  Crazy world.

• 7 Taxi Driver // Apr 13, 2007 at 8:19 pm

  This is indeed a surprise – the speed at which the pardon has come about. I wonder if all the YouTube hoopla had anything to do with it?

  Come to think of it, this saga has provided an insight into the leanings of the Palace. Why did the Palace pardon him at this time after the verdict and sentence had been handed down? If the Palace had always thought this saga was an overreaction for overzealous local officials, why didn’t they intervene quietly earlier, before the case even went before the courts and attracted international attention? Does it prove that the Palace believes the lese majeste law is still a useful tool, and the Jufer case serves as an example/reminder that, at the end of the day, you are at the mercy of their whim?

  If I was a King, I’d want Lese Majeste Laws too, no?

• 8 Jon Fernquest // Apr 14, 2007 at 1:19 pm

  Streckfuss’s op-ed piece is notable in many respects.

  First, that he uses examples outside of Thailand, like how a lese majeste action can only be instituted by the king himself in some European countries. IMHO more cross-cultural examples should be used in Southeast history/studies instead of treating countries such as Thailand and Burma as insular special cases all the time.

  Second, Streckfuss outlines the situation of Thais and the lese majeste law as essentially being one of the prisoner’s dilemma in game theory, one way out of is to have a powerful arbitrator break the impasse, which is exactly what HMK has done over and over again in recent history, save his nation from being ripped apart by factionalism. It’s a pity that the Thai elite cannot do what he wants, namely get rid of the lese majeste law or modify it so that only HMK himself can use it. Might it even be lese majeste to disregard HMKs word like this? Or more likely, lese majeste for me to make this suggestion.

  I think the bottom-line is that information travels fast nowadays over the internet and can’t be suppressed, so they are rethinking the free-wheeling way they used to use the law in the past, with foreigners, but not with non-elite Thais, like whatever happened to the Buddhist Nun who got charged with lese majeste? And what did she do? What the “offenders” did is what everyone always wants to know, but apparently can’t be reported legally, which again seems to contradict what HMK ordered Thai elites to do in 2005.

• 9 serf // Apr 14, 2007 at 1:49 pm

  QUOTE If Jufer had been a Thai nobody would have cared of that story…
  Crazy world. UNQUOTE

  Charity begins at home. Right? Farangs may be stupid, but in most cases they know better than to try and interfere with local laws that most locals couldn’t care a toss about changing.

• 10 Batman // Apr 16, 2007 at 6:50 pm

  This conversation about the King featuring Dr Craig Reynolds, Paul Handley and Thitinan Pongsudhirak has to be careful about lese majeste. Gives a history of the King’ role in politics

  http://www.abc.net.au/rn/rearvision/

• 11 Timokl // Apr 17, 2007 at 2:00 am

  Jon Fernquest mentions in his comment a story about a nun who got charged with lese majeste. I don’t know this story, but I would like to know more about it. Anyone who knows this story?

• 12 Frank G Anderson // Jul 20, 2008 at 12:20 am

  19 July 2008

  Back in 2007 Jon asked about that nun who was arrested for lese majeste,wondering about details of the case.
  I am still translating some of the various reports on it, but to date it is revealed that she was implicated by a novice who used to be close to her and was transferred to a temple in Chiangmai. While there he was arrested by police for lese majeste – seems he was pretending to be a royal heir. In facing a sentence of 50 years!, he confessed all and implicated the nun in supporting his claim and being involved. Police in both provinces coordinated evidence and then went to her temple in Ayutyaha in 2005 and arrested her. She was taken right off to interrogation and jailed. The novice’s sentence was reduced to 25 years, but I don’t know yet if he is still in jail or was released.

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